Origins Thread

[Tiger]

Ok James, in terms of your question (and no, I’m not going to spend this evening with an inane back and forth) —‘What do they have to do with each other?’— this actually highlights a crucial point in the limitations of strictly evolutionary thinking.

Evolution, as a theory, works within the framework of pre-existing matter and established physical laws, but it offers no explanatory power regarding the origin of those laws or the underlying principles that permit life and complexity in the first place. When we speak of evolution, we’re operating within an existing cosmos whose fundamental structures must first be assumed rather than explained.

Are you agreeing with this?
In other words, to focus on evolutionary mechanisms alone is to philosophically sidestep the greater question of why there is a universe capable of supporting those mechanisms at all. Without acknowledging this, an exclusively evolutionary worldview can border on the circular: we describe processes but often fail to address their foundational cause.

I appreciate your honesty in acknowledging science’s limits, which is more than many are willing to concede. So, I ask you: are you open to the possibility that the question of origins necessarily points to a dimension beyond empirical science, one that might require integrating philosophical or metaphysical perspectives to truly account for existence and purpose?

 

[AN2]

Just ban me and get it over with

I'm not replying to ChatGPT

 

[Tiger]

Just ban me and get it over with

I'm not replying to ChatGPT

You’ll only be banned for spamming.

Just answer the (very basic) questions being asked.

Anyone that is neutral reading this will be wondering why someone as passionately behind Darwinian theory as you can’t give a coherent response to very basic questions.

 

[AN2]

If you have a question to ask, write it yourself. It shouldn't take more than a sentence or two

 

[Tiger]

If you have a question to ask, write it yourself. It shouldn't take more than a sentence or two

I already have. If you can’t answer it. Just admit it. The questions were not complex in the slightest.

Let’s simply start with the pre-existing laws to allow Darwinian evolution.

Where and how did they arise?

 

[AN2]

I'm not replying to ChatGPT

If you can't formulate a question (in a sentence, or two) - then give up

Or just do what you're itching to do

 

[Tiger]

I'm not replying to ChatGPT

If you can't formulate a question (in a sentence, or two) - then give up

Or just do what you're itching to do

You’re a coward. I literally gave you the most basic question I could.

You look like an idiot.

 

[AN2]

You’re a coward. I literally gave you the most basic question I could.

Copy pasting shite from ChatGPT is not asking a question

 

[Tiger]

Copy pasting shite from ChatGPT is not asking a question

I’m ignoring your pathetic deflection.

Let’s simply start with the pre-existing laws to allow Darwinian evolution.

Where and how did they arise?

 

[AN2]

I’m ignoring your pathetic deflection.

Let’s simply start with the pre-existing laws to allow Darwinian evolution.

Where and how did they arise?

The origin of life is unknown

Evolution (of species) posits nothing about the origin of life

Those are two facts

Something you're profoundly unfamiliar with

 

[Tiger]

The origin of life is unknown

Evolution (of species) posits nothing about the origin of life

Those are two facts

Something you're profoundly unfamiliar with

So your answer is- ‘haven’t a fucking clue mate’.

Is that correct?

 

[AN2]

So your answer is- ‘haven’t a fucking clue mate’.

Is that correct?

Yeah but neither do you

You theists have this idiotic idea that because the atheists can't explain it you can

 

[AN2]

Yeah but neither do you

You theists have this idiotic idea that because the atheists can't explain it you can

Btw that's ^ assuming you were talking about origin of life. Your question was obviously vague

 

[AN2]

The bottom line is, you have nowhere to go.

Regurgitating shit from the countless hours of waffle from religious sources you've consumed won't truly question, or affirm, a goddamn thing.

Other than make someone like Dawkins a millionaire

 

[AN2]

Ladies and gentlemen...


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kHz8ft56lQQ

Okay @Tiger, how about you elucidate a little more on what you believe and why.

We could start with evolution.. Complete bunkum, crafted by the hand of God, Adam and Eve, what is it?

 

[Tiger]

Ladies and gentleman...


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kHz8ft56lQQ

Okay @Tiger, how about you elucidate a little more on what you believe and why.

We could start with evolution.. Complete bunkum, crafted by the hand of God, Adam and Eve, what is it?

You’re starting to spam again.

If you have nothing to say. Shut up.

 

[AN2]

You’re starting to spam again.

If you have nothing to say. Shut up.

Is it not you who has nothing to say?

 

[Tiger]

Is it not you who has nothing to say?

James, your scant knowledge of evolution is about 3 decades out of date.

You still believe in Darwinian evolution 1.0 despite it being put in the dustbin.

You’re so out of touch on the subject that you still think Richard Dawkins is relevant. He’s a fossil.

 

[AN2]

James, your scant knowledge of evolution is about 3 decades out of date.

You still believe in Darwinian evolution 1.0 despite it being put in the dustbin.

You’re so out of touch on the subject that you still think Richard Dawkins is relevant. He’s a fossil.

But I asked you what you believe about it, exampling a broad range of views

 

[Tiger]

But I asked you what you believe about it, exampling a broad range of views

Even Myles and his shrivelled brain know what I believe in.

When was the last time that you read a book? 1992?

 

[AN2]

Even Myles and his shrivelled brain know what I believe in.

I honestly don't

Do you believe in any formula of us being evolved, or are you an Adam and Eve guy? It's a fair question!

 

[Tiger]

I honestly don't

Do you believe in any formula of us being evolved, or are you an Adam and Eve guy? It's a fair question!

The ‘Adam and Eve’ question is always an interesting one.

Atheists tend to ask it as a form of small minded mockery, unaware that their own high priests of science agree that all of humankind came from two parents, which they call ‘mitochondrial Adam and Eve’. So, the idea of ‘Adam and Eve’ isn't something we should just dismiss as a simple myth.

Biologically, every one of us has two parents, which is encoded directly into our DNA. The presence of X and Y chromosomes is a fundamental signal — an indelible mark that every human being is the product of a father and a mother.

So, whether we call these original parents ‘Adam and Eve’ or simply ‘our first mother and father,’ the core truth remains: we all originate from this two-parent structure, and it’s integral to who we are as human beings. It’s not just symbolic; it’s biologically foundational.

 

[AN2]

The ‘Adam and Eve’ question is always an interesting one.

Atheists tend to ask it as a form of small minded mockery,

I wasn't particularly engaging in mockery, more trying to get you to answer a straightforward question

unaware that their own high priests of science agree that all of humankind came from two parents, which they call ‘mitochondrial Adam and Eve’. So, the idea of ‘Adam and Eve’ isn't something we should just dismiss as a simple myth.

Atheists People who believe in evolution don't believe that our ancestors were human, or that we popped into existence. Is that what you believe?

Biologically, every one of us has two parents, which is encoded directly into our DNA. The presence of X and Y chromosomes is a fundamental signal — an indelible mark that every human being is the product of a father and a mother.

So, whether we call these original parents ‘Adam and Eve’ or simply ‘our first mother and father,’ the core truth remains: we all originate from this two-parent structure, and it’s integral to who we are as human beings. It’s not just symbolic; it’s biologically foundational.

 

[Tiger]

I wasn't particularly engaging in mockery, more trying to get you to answer a straightforward question


Atheists People who believe in evolution don't believe that our ancestors were human, or that we popped into existence. Is that what you believe?

Is that so? Walk us through the history of the X Y chromosomes then.

Was it one particular fertile couple of apes out of the presumably hundreds of thousands (if not more apes) that gave birth to the parents of all humankind, passing down this one strand of X and Y chromosomes? Some sort of astronomically small ‘fluke’?

Or do you think that we’ve all arrived here via different ‘ape’ heritage?

 

[AN2]

Is that so? Walk us through the history of the X Y chromosomes then.

Was it one particular fertile couple of apes out of the presumably hundreds of thousands (if not more apes) that gave birth to the parents of all humankind, passing down this one strand of X and Y chromosomes? Some sort of astronomically small ‘fluke’?

Or do you think that we’ve all arrived here via different ‘ape’ heritage?

It's funny that you say that my evolutionary theory is decades out of date yet you push the trope that we're descended from apes. We, along with our other living primate cousins have a common ape-like ancestor.

You stíll haven't answered the question

 

[Tiger]

It's funny that you say that my evolutionary theory is decades out of date yet you push the trope that we're descended from apes. We, along with our other living primate cousins have a common ape-like ancestor.

You stíll haven't answered the question

I don’t think we’re descended from apes or a ‘common primate ancestor’. Both have no solid evidence. There’s a real reason why, in the past 10 years scientists have been rejecting evolution 1.0 (Darwinian evolution) and coming up with new theories (evolution 2.0). Richard Dawkins and his followers are stuck in evolution 1.0.


In terms of answering your question. Let’s get down to it: Is every person — from Aboriginal Australians to yuppies in Manhattan and nomads from Outer Mongolia — descended from two original human parents? Yes or no? The origin of the X and Y chromosomes says ‘yes,’ pointing to a common human origin, not an undefined ‘ape-like ancestor.’ I believe in those two original parents, created with purpose by a higher intelligence — the same intelligence behind the laws of the universe that sustain all life.

Where’s the solid evidence that we’re descended from an ape-like creature? Frankly, it’s fantasy. The fossil record doesn’t back it up. Without real proof, the story of common descent is nothing more than an imaginative leap, dressed up as science.

Can you provide an answer to the question about the origin of the X and Y chromosomes?

 

[AN2]

I don’t think we’re descended from apes or a ‘common primate ancestor’. Both have no solid evidence. There’s a real reason why, in the past 10 years scientists have been rejecting evolution 1.0 (Darwinian evolution) and coming up with new theories (evolution 2.0). Richard Dawkins and his followers are stuck in evolution 1.0.

I'm simply asking you whether you believe humans are evolved?

Do you believe that there was a time before in which the human species didn't exist and that we are descended from other living creatures that weren't human?

In terms of answering your question. Let’s get down to it: Is every person — from Aboriginal Australians to yuppies in Manhattan and nomads from Outer Mongolia — descended from two original human parents? Yes or no? The origin of the X and Y chromosomes says ‘yes,’ pointing to a common human origin, not an undefined ‘ape-like ancestor.’ I believe in those two original parents, created with purpose by a higher intelligence — the same intelligence behind the laws of the universe that sustain all life.

Where’s the solid evidence that we’re descended from an ape-like creature? Frankly, it’s fantasy. The fossil record doesn’t back it up. Without real proof, the story of common descent is nothing more than an imaginative leap, dressed up as science.

Can you provide an answer to the question about the origin of the X and Y chromosomes?

 

[Tiger]

I'm simply asking you whether you believe humans are evolved?

Do you believe that there was a time before in which the human species didn't exist and that we are descended from other living creatures that weren't human?

I’ve already said that I believe humans didn’t evolve from non-human creatures but came from two specific parents, which the existence of the X and Y chromosomes supports. These chromosomes point to a unique, common origin for all humankind — not a random progression from non-human life forms. There is no bio-chemical evidence to counter this.

This is one way discussion at the moment.

Now, for this to be a proper discussion, it can’t just be me answering all the questions. You’ll need to engage and answer a few yourself rather than deflecting each time. So, I’ll ask again: where’s the concrete, fossil-based evidence of an unbroken lineage from non-human ancestors to humans?

Do you believe that all humans across the planet, from Aborigines in Australia to Norwegians have descended from one set of parents?

Yes or no?

 

[AN2]

I’ve already said that I believe humans didn’t evolve from non-human creatures but came from two specific parents,

Who, Adam and Eve? Were they human? Where did they come from?

which the existence of the X and Y chromosomes supports. These chromosomes point to a unique, common origin for all humankind — not a random progression from non-human life forms. There is no bio-chemical evidence to counter this.

This is one way discussion at the moment.

Now, for this to be a proper discussion, it can’t just be me answering all the questions. You’ll need to engage and answer a few yourself rather than deflecting each time. So, I’ll ask again: where’s the concrete, fossil-based evidence of an unbroken lineage from non-human ancestors to humans?

Do you believe that all humans across the planet, from Aborigines in Australia to Norwegians have descended from one set of parents?

Yes or no?

I believe in evolution, which obviously includes humans.

It's fairly apparent that you don't.. Which begs the question, why in the whole wide world of f*ck are you arguing about it, evolution one point O, two point O etc.

 

[Tiger]

Who, Adam and Eve? Were they human? Where did they come from?


I believe in evolution, which obviously includes humans.

It's fairly apparent that you don't.. Which begs the question, why in the whole wide world of f*ck are you arguing about it, evolution one point O, two point O etc.

That’s a pathetic response.

James: you haven’t answered ANY of my questions. Instead, you’re just recycling your beliefs without engaging with the actual evidence or the implications of what I’ve said. Your responses are superficial and fail to address the critical issues at hand.

Repeating phrases like ‘evolution 1.0 or 2.0’ doesn’t make your argument valid; it just shows a lack of depth and understanding of the topic. If you’re going to claim you believe in evolution, then put some substance behind it. Stop dodging the questions and actually tackle the arguments being presented.

Answer the question about all of humanity coming from 2 parents. Do you think this is true or not?

 

[AN2]

That’s a pathetic response.

James: you haven’t answered ANY of my questions. Instead, you’re just recycling your beliefs without engaging with the actual evidence or the implications of what I’ve said. Your responses are superficial and fail to address the critical issues at hand.

Repeating phrases like ‘evolution 1.0 or 2.0’ doesn’t make your argument valid; it just shows a lack of depth and understanding of the topic. If you’re going to claim you believe in evolution, then put some substance behind it. Stop dodging the questions and actually tackle the arguments being presented.

I don't use those phrases, those are your phrases

Answer the question about all of humanity coming from 2 parents. Do you think this is true or not?

I find it difficult to parse your question - it's so fucking stupid (in a debate about evolution)

 

[Tiger]

I don't use those phrases, those are your phrases


I find it difficult to parse your question - it's so fucking stupid (in a debate about evolution)

It's telling that you resort to calling my questions 'stupid' instead of actually addressing them.

That kind of dismissal shows a lack of intellectual rigor and an inability to engage with challenging ideas. If you can't handle a bit of complexity in a debate about evolution, maybe you shouldn't be in this conversation at all.

You’ve never offered anything to this debate.

It’s not about whether my questions fit neatly into your worldview; it's about whether you can back up your beliefs with real evidence. It’s clear that you can’t. So, instead of throwing around insults, why not put in the effort to actually engage with the issues? It’s time to step up or step aside.

 

[AN2]

It's telling that you resort to calling my questions 'stupid' instead of actually addressing them.

That kind of dismissal shows a lack of intellectual rigor and an inability to engage with challenging ideas. If you can't handle a bit of complexity in a debate about evolution, maybe you shouldn't be in this conversation at all.

You’ve never offered anything to this debate.

It’s not about whether my questions fit neatly into your worldview; it's about whether you can back up your beliefs with real evidence. It’s clear that you can’t. So, instead of throwing around insults, why not put in the effort to actually engage with the issues? It’s time to step up or step aside.

Dude, you don't believe that humans are evolved

And you believe that "all of humanity" is the product of "two specific [human] parents"

Am I misrepresenting what you believe?

 

[Tiger]

Dude, you don't believe that humans are evolved

And you believe that "all of humanity" is the product of "two specific [human] parents"

Am I misrepresenting what you believe?

I believe that all of humanity descends from two specific human parents, which is a position rooted in the evidence of X and Y chromosomes, not some fantastical notion. As you are an intellectual coward, you can't even say whether you agree or disagree with this statement.

What’s baffling is your continued failure to provide anything of value in this discussion. Instead of addressing my points or engaging with the evidence, you’re just throwing out vague assertions and mischaracterizations. If you want to debate, bring some substance to the table instead of dancing around the issue. Otherwise, this conversation is going nowhere.

Last chance for you, otherwise I’ll have to block you for spamming again. You’ve had plenty of chance to make your point and answer my questions.

 

[AN2]

I believe that all of humanity descends from two specific human parents, which is a position rooted in the evidence of X and Y chromosomes, not some fantastical notion. As you are an intellectual coward, you can't even say whether you agree or disagree with this statement.

What’s baffling is your continued failure to provide anything of value in this discussion. Instead of addressing my points or engaging with the evidence, you’re just throwing out vague assertions and mischaracterizations. If you want to debate, bring some substance to the table instead of dancing around the issue. Otherwise, this conversation is going nowhere.

Last chance for you, otherwise I’ll have to block you for spamming again. You’ve had plenty of chance to make your point and answer my questions.

Block me, you lying piece of shit. I'll continue exposing your bullshit elsewhere

 

[Tiger]

Block me, you lying piece of shit. I'll continue exposing your bullshit elsewhere

You’ll expose nothing.

You haven’t read a book since reading a Stephen King novel in the 1990’s.

You clearly haven’t a clue about this subject matter which is why you never say anything of substance.

 

[AN2]

 

[AN2]

 

[Wolf]

Another shit thread about the same fucking shite.

 

[Professor]

Yes, we see evolution in many areas, especially with a little human intervention to assist in the process otherwise the process continues randomly in accordance with environmental conditions etc etc.

But certainly, there is human evolution/devolution/dilution to be observed.