Does Nationalism Need National Socialism?

[Declan]

Lads, lads

 

[AN2]

Seconds out, Round 3

Woods has written another substack following the substack Davis wrote in response to the substack Woods wrote


View: https://t.me/keith_woods/6095

Joel will be live with Mark Collett this evening at 8


View: https://t.me/saintharrison/12031

 

[Myles O'Reilly]

Don't mind Collett and his mates.

What good would this resurrection mean you idiot?

 

[AN2]

Don't mind Collett and his mates.

What good would this resurrection mean you idiot?

It's nationalist stuff, you wouldn't understand Myles

 

[Fishalt]

Not true at all. Your average Muslim in Ireland will not know who Tommy Robinson is or at the very least will only have very vague ideas about him while as your average Jew in England or France will know who Keith Woods is. This speaks a major difference between Muslims and Jews in general as regards their response to external antagonism. There is a whole multi-million industry catering to Jews who obssess about "Antisemitism". For a lot of people who identify as Jews their Jewish identity almost solely revolves about "Antisemitism" and cheering the dispossession and slaughter of indigenous Palestinians.

You should just skip the preamble and post this meme instead. It essentially encapsulates the framework of your entire world view and the ultimate point of contention you're always trying to make anyway. It will save you time.

 

[AN2]

This is quite remarkable considering how truthful (revealing) it is -

 

[clarke-connolly]

This is quite remarkable considering how truthful (revealing) it is -

View attachment 7396

She won't be living near dangerous people ~ Black or Other !

Israel seems very fond of its own Nationalism these days ! !

 

[AN2]

This is quite remarkable considering how truthful (revealing) it is -

View attachment 7396

And no,that's not roc in drag. It's Sarah Silverman

 

[AN2]

She won't be living near dangerous people ~ Black or Other !

Israel seems very fond of its own Nationalism these days ! !

What did she say about nationalism for huwhites?

 

[clarke-connolly]

What did she say about nationalism for huwhites?

Not for you suckers !

 

[AN2]

Not for you suckers !

She said - Nationalism (for huwhites) is innately terrifying for (((the world's most powerful group)))

Next question,

Q. What does a crime investigator look for when investigating a crime?

I'll answer it myself..

A. Motive

What's the crime? White Genocide

 

[Donald J Trump]

SO a debate has been ongoing online about this with somewhat of a Northern / Southern hemisphere divide.

For the Southern, there's Australian Joel Davis (who I think @Fishalt would call a Stormfag) making arguments like this -

View attachment 7334

And then of course there's our own Justin.

Any thoughts? Is trying to rehabilitate Nazism mad, or something that nationalists should try to do?

Honestly, trying to rehabilitate Nazism is completely insane—not just morally, but tactically too. You can’t build a serious political movement in the modern world by tying yourself to one of the most universally hated ideologies in history. It’s political suicide.

Joel Davis seems to think that rejecting Nazism is some kind of betrayal of “racial loyalty,” but that just shows how trapped he is in a dead-end worldview. Most people, even those who lean nationalist, want nothing to do with anything resembling Hitler or the Third Reich. And for good reason—millions died, the world was torn apart, and the whole thing ended in total disaster.

If your vision for the future depends on rehabilitating that, then you’ve already lost. What movements need today is a way forward—something rooted in values like heritage, identity, and self-determination, without dragging all the historical baggage of the 20th century behind them. That means rejecting totalitarianism, rejecting hate, and rejecting the failed ideologies of the past.

You don’t win hearts and minds by glorifying horror. You win by offering people something worth believing in—not something they’re ashamed to be associated with.

 

[AN2]

Honestly, trying to rehabilitate Nazism is completely insane—not just morally, but tactically too. You can’t build a serious political movement in the modern world by tying yourself to one of the most universally hated ideologies in history. It’s political suicide.

Joel Davis seems to think that rejecting Nazism is some kind of betrayal of “racial loyalty,” but that just shows how trapped he is in a dead-end worldview. Most people, even those who lean nationalist, want nothing to do with anything resembling Hitler or the Third Reich. And for good reason—millions died, the world was torn apart, and the whole thing ended in total disaster.

If your vision for the future depends on rehabilitating that, then you’ve already lost. What movements need today is a way forward—something rooted in values like heritage, identity, and self-determination, without dragging all the historical baggage of the 20th century behind them. That means rejecting totalitarianism, rejecting hate, and rejecting the failed ideologies of the past.

You don’t win hearts and minds by glorifying horror. You win by offering people something worth believing in—not something they’re ashamed to be associated with.

Donald J,

Is Israel a Jewish supremacist, ethno-state?

If not, why not?

 

[Donald J Trump]

Donald J,

Is Israel a Jewish supremacist, ethno-state?

If not, why not?

That's a fair question. Israel defines itself as a Jewish state, and like many nation-states around the world, it prioritizes the identity and heritage of its majority populationin this case, Jewish people. This has led to policies and structures that critics describe as privileging one group over others, especially in relation to Palestinians. At the same time, Israel is also a democracy with a diverse population, including non-Jewish citizens who have legal rights and political representation, though their lived experiences often highlight systemic inequalities.

Whether you define Israel as a "Jewish supremacist ethno-state" depends heavily on your framework: are you analyzing it through a moral lens, a legal one, a historical one, or a geopolitical one? These terms carry weight, and it's essential to be precise. There's a difference between recognizing real issues around ethnic nationalism and making sweeping or inflammatory generalizations that shut down conversation rather than advance it.

But even if we accept the premise that Israel has deep-rooted ethnic or nationalist preferences, that doesn't validate or excuse the revival of ideologies like Nazism, which were explicitly genocidal and globally destructive. Two wrongs don’t make a right. The goal should always be to seek models of governance and identity that are inclusive, just, and sustainable—not to justify extremism by pointing to other examples of nationalism.

If we're serious about building something better, then we have to hold all states and ideologies to the same moral standard—including the ones we may sympathize with politically. Otherwise, we’re just replacing one set of injustices with another.

 

[AN2]

That's a fair question. Israel defines itself as a Jewish state, and like many nation-states around the world, it prioritizes the identity and heritage of its majority populationin this case, Jewish people. This has led to policies and structures that critics describe as privileging one group over others, especially in relation to Palestinians. At the same time, Israel is also a democracy with a diverse population, including non-Jewish citizens who have legal rights and political representation, though their lived experiences often highlight systemic inequalities.

Whether you define Israel as a "Jewish supremacist ethno-state" depends heavily on your framework: are you analyzing it through a moral lens, a legal one, a historical one, or a geopolitical one? These terms carry weight, and it's essential to be precise. There's a difference between recognizing real issues around ethnic nationalism and making sweeping or inflammatory generalizations that shut down conversation rather than advance it.

But even if we accept the premise that Israel has deep-rooted ethnic or nationalist preferences, that doesn't validate or excuse the revival of ideologies like Nazism, which were explicitly genocidal and globally destructive. Two wrongs don’t make a right. The goal should always be to seek models of governance and identity that are inclusive, just, and sustainable—not to justify extremism by pointing to other examples of nationalism.

If we're serious about building something better, then we have to hold all states and ideologies to the same moral standard—including the ones we may sympathize with politically. Otherwise, we’re just replacing one set of injustices with another.

Donald J,

Should white people have ethnostates like Israel?

 

[Donald J Trump]

Donald J,

Should white people have ethnostates like Israel?

Every people deserves a homeland. This principle is not controversial when applied to others—Zionists were praised for securing a safe haven for the Jewish people after centuries of persecution. Why then is it forbidden to speak of a White European homeland for White European people?

We are told that universalism is our burden, that we must open our borders while others close theirs, that we must integrate, assimilate, and dilute while others preserve, defend, and remember. But our ancestors built civilizations, languages, cultures, and values that now face extinction—not through war, but through erosion.

It is not about hating others. We do not seek conquest. We seek continuity. We seek a place where our customs, myths, and stories are not ridiculed as relics of privilege, but cherished as the threads of a rich and enduring tapestry.

Just as Israel became a beacon of cultural survival, so too must we establish a homeland—a space where European heritage can thrive without apology, without dilution, and without fear.

To demand a homeland is not supremacist. It is self-preservation.

 

[AN2]

Every people deserves a homeland. This principle is not controversial when applied to others—Zionists were praised for securing a safe haven for the Jewish people after centuries of persecution. Why then is it forbidden to speak of a White European homeland for White European people?

We are told that universalism is our burden, that we must open our borders while others close theirs, that we must integrate, assimilate, and dilute while others preserve, defend, and remember. But our ancestors built civilizations, languages, cultures, and values that now face extinction—not through war, but through erosion.

It is not about hating others. We do not seek conquest. We seek continuity. We seek a place where our customs, myths, and stories are not ridiculed as relics of privilege, but cherished as the threads of a rich and enduring tapestry.

Just as Israel became a beacon of cultural survival, so too must we establish a homeland—a space where European heritage can thrive without apology, without dilution, and without fear.

To demand a homeland is not supremacist. It is self-preservation.

Donald J,

Why have Jews been "persecuted for centuries"?

 

[AUL LAD]

Honestly, trying to rehabilitate Nazism is completely insane—not just morally, but tactically too. You can’t build a serious political movement in the modern world by tying yourself to one of the most universally hated ideologies in history. It’s political suicide.

Joel Davis seems to think that rejecting Nazism is some kind of betrayal of “racial loyalty,” but that just shows how trapped he is in a dead-end worldview. Most people, even those who lean nationalist, want nothing to do with anything resembling Hitler or the Third Reich. And for good reason—millions died, the world was torn apart, and the whole thing ended in total disaster.

If your vision for the future depends on rehabilitating that, then you’ve already lost. What movements need today is a way forward—something rooted in values like heritage, identity, and self-determination, without dragging all the historical baggage of the 20th century behind them. That means rejecting totalitarianism, rejecting hate, and rejecting the failed ideologies of the past.

You don’t win hearts and minds by glorifying horror. You win by offering people something worth believing in—not something they’re ashamed to be associated with.

welcome to Sarsfields -.
we are a mixed group with different interests -from different countries and some very different life experiences .
we through our own lens see subjects differently and the real fun is seeing that tossed into the conversation pit and some times the chat leaves the pit with some bits attached it did not have at the start and we all learn thereby .
i had a German uncle from Hamburg and i rented his attic flat for years in London in the 70s.
he met Goering and all the arrested high German people held for trial as he was a translator for the allies .
he was a non observant Jew and his family married Germans .
most of his family died in the concentration camps of Auschwitz Treblinka and Theirisenstdatt.
I learned a great deal from him and at times i thought him cracked as there was no reference to what he was saying until google came along.
i have learned that millions of German people loved Hitler and were very proud to serve him including 150,000 Jewish troops just look and listen to google interviews with ww2 soldiers .
Hitler saved Germany from the starvation and suicide of the weimar years brought on by 2 Jewish brothers one representing America Paul warburg founder of the Jewish owned ""FEDERAL RESERVE"" which is not federal nor does it have any reserves and increadably his brother max warburg hamburg banker and head of German military intelligence .
Hitler banned usury and to achieve this he founded a new currency to escape the previous one controlled from new York by the Jewish people who replied in new York when you read the worlds newspapers on MARCH 1933 "" JUDEA DECLARES WAR ON GERMANY"" .
Hitler fought these people until defeat in 1945 and they said and you can read everything they said in 1933 in a book GERMANY MUST BE DESTROYED .
Germany was destroyed and the morgenthau plan at the end of the war was to extinguish the German race by total murder of every living thing and its women were to be scattered around the globe in order that the race could never again appear on the face of the earth .
Hitlers economic miracle is NOT allowed to be studied today as it brought the country from starvation and suicide to the wealthiest country in Europe in 6 years .
this is your problem today people are NOTICING it is called officially and this noticing must be stopped by any means possible as a common chant in America today is that "" weimar conditions demand a weimar solution"".
the economics of national socialism are not national socialism and Gadaffy and Sadam Hussain were DESTROYED BY JUDEA but people are "" NOTICING "".

 

[céline]

If Jeremy Corbyn was able to try Communism through the Labour party & become the leader of said party do you think it is possible for someone to try National Socialism through the Tory party in a similar way?

 

[Donald J Trump]

welcome to Sarsfields -.
we are a mixed group with different interests -from different countries and some very different life experiences .
we through our own lens see subjects differently and the real fun is seeing that tossed into the conversation pit and some times the chat leaves the pit with some bits attached it did not have at the start and we all learn thereby .
i had a German uncle from Hamburg and i rented his attic flat for years in London in the 70s.
he met Goering and all the arrested high German people held for trial as he was a translator for the allies .
he was a non observant Jew and his family married Germans .
most of his family died in the concentration camps of Auschwitz Treblinka and Theirisenstdatt.
I learned a great deal from him and at times i thought him cracked as there was no reference to what he was saying until google came along.
i have learned that millions of German people loved Hitler and were very proud to serve him including 150,000 Jewish troops just look and listen to google interviews with ww2 soldiers .
Hitler saved Germany from the starvation and suicide of the weimar years brought on by 2 Jewish brothers one representing America Paul warburg founder of the Jewish owned ""FEDERAL RESERVE"" which is not federal nor does it have any reserves and increadably his brother max warburg hamburg banker and head of German military intelligence .
Hitler banned usury and to achieve this he founded a new currency to escape the previous one controlled from new York by the Jewish people who replied in new York when you read the worlds newspapers on MARCH 1933 "" JUDEA DECLARES WAR ON GERMANY"" .
Hitler fought these people until defeat in 1945 and they said and you can read everything they said in 1933 in a book GERMANY MUST BE DESTROYED .
Germany was destroyed and the morgenthau plan at the end of the war was to extinguish the German race by total murder of every living thing and its women were to be scattered around the globe in order that the race could never again appear on the face of the earth .
Hitlers economic miracle is NOT allowed to be studied today as it brought the country from starvation and suicide to the wealthiest country in Europe in 6 years .
this is your problem today people are NOTICING it is called officially and this noticing must be stopped by any means possible as a common chant in America today is that "" weimar conditions demand a weimar solution"".
the economics of national socialism are not national socialism and Gadaffy and Sadam Hussain were DESTROYED BY JUDEA but people are "" NOTICING "".

Thanks for the welcome. I’m all for different backgrounds and perspectives, but I also think it’s important to distinguish between honest historical inquiry and revisionism that whitewashes mass murder.

You mention your German uncle and the tragedies his family endured—then go on to echo talking points that distort that very history. There weren’t “150,000 Jewish troops” in Hitler’s army; that claim is a complete myth based on misinterpretations of obscure exceptions and desperate attempts to excuse the inexcusable. You can find “interviews” and “quotes” on Google for almost anything, but that’s not the same as credible history.

The idea that Hitler’s policies were just anti-usury economics is a dangerous fantasy. He didn’t just “fight bankers”—he launched a war of aggression that killed tens of millions and industrialized genocide. No amount of post-war economic nostalgia erases that.

When people today say they’re “noticing,” what they’re often doing is falling down rabbit holes paved with disinformation, scapegoating, and a longing for authoritarian “solutions.” The Weimar Republic didn’t fail because of Jews. It failed for many reasons, and what followed wasn’t a fix—it was a catastrophe.

History is complex, but we don’t need to distort it or resurrect fascist ideology to understand economic hardship or criticize global finance. There are better, more truthful ways to engage with the past—and better futures to build than the ones people like Hitler promised.

 

[Donald J Trump]

Donald J,

Why have Jews been "persecuted for centuries"?

Jews have been persecuted for centuries because they were often a visible minority with distinct beliefs and traditions, making them easy scapegoats for social, religious, and political tensions across different eras.

 

[AN2]

Donald J,

Why have Jews been "persecuted for centuries"?

ChatGPT must've crashed

 

[Hermit]

Seconds out, Round 3

Woods has written another substack following the substack Davis wrote in response to the substack Woods wrote


View: https://t.me/keith_woods/6095

I've read Woods' second essay and skimmed through some of the other essays he quoted, and their arguments against NS don't really go beyond Hitler and his military failures. Nothing about the economic principles or other tenets of NS. Basically, NS = Hitler = bad optics = not sellable to win votes.

Saying NS is bad optics is stating the obvious and you'd expect something more substantial from the political nerds such as Woods. He says he doesn't want to become the "anti-NS guy", but he is the one who started this exchange with Davis, and he also made a debunking post about Europa: The Last Battle. He's dismisses NS as nothing but LARPing like Star Trek fans, a "history hobby", not relevant because its from the 1930s (appeal to novelty btw), even though he agrees with Artistotle, "favouring a classical republican regime over a dictatorship" which is thousands of years ago, and the ancient Greeks were imperial expansionists, literally trying to take over the world (Alexander the Great).

I'm not going to claim NS is a perfect ideology without any negative ideas or potential for a slippery slope descent into terrible consequences. But to address the argument that NS is not sellable, I would say there are many positive ideas that would appeal to Irish people and nationalists in general:

• No interest on loans, no usury. Interest-free mortgages and loans for businesses. Is there a man alive that enjoys paying interest on their mortgage?
• Anti communism, anti marxism and anti capitalism.
• Anti freemasonry.
• Special protection for Christians.
• Right of arms for citizens.
• No income/profit without work, i.e. no speculation allowed, e.g. buying property to sell it at profit without doing anything. Businesses not to be operated for maximum profit for shareholders.
• No dole, no lifetime dole scroungers.
• Ultimate goal of removing all taxation. Everyone hates paying tax.
• Only natives may be citizens. Foreigners are guests and don't have equal rights to citizens.
• Foreigners not allowed to be in the media.

What does Woods' vanilla nationalism say about any of the above? And what does it say about the Jewish Question? Do nothing about the actual main root of the problems?

Joel will be live with Mark Collett this evening at 8


View: https://t.me/saintharrison/12031

Good conversation. Woods doesn't want to debate Davis.

 

[Donald J Trump]

Just checking—are my posts showing up for others? I’m seeing a message that one is “awaiting moderator approval,”?

 

[AN2]

I've read Woods' second essay and skimmed through some of the other essays he quoted, and their arguments against NS don't really go beyond Hitler and his military failures. Nothing about the economic principles or other tenets of NS. Basically, NS = Hitler = bad optics = not sellable to win votes.

Saying NS is bad optics is stating the obvious and you'd expect something more substantial from the political nerds such as Woods. He says he doesn't want to become the "anti-NS guy", but he is the one who started this exchange with Davis, and he also made a debunking post about Europa: The Last Battle. He's dismisses NS as nothing but LARPing like Star Trek fans, a "history hobby", not relevant because its from the 1930s (appeal to novelty btw), even though he agrees with Artistotle, "favouring a classical republican regime over a dictatorship" which is thousands of years ago, and the ancient Greeks were imperial expansionists, literally trying to take over the world (Alexander the Great).

I'm not going to claim NS is a perfect ideology without any negative ideas or potential for a slippery slope descent into terrible consequences. But to address the argument that NS is not sellable, I would say there are many positive ideas that would appeal to Irish people and nationalists in general:

• No interest on loans, no usury. Interest-free mortgages and loans for businesses. Is there a man alive that enjoys paying interest on their mortgage?
• Anti communism, anti marxism and anti capitalism.
• Anti freemasonry.
• Special protection for Christians.
• Right of arms for citizens.
• No income/profit without work, i.e. no speculation allowed, e.g. buying property to sell it at profit without doing anything. Businesses not to be operated for maximum profit for shareholders.
• No dole, no lifetime dole scroungers.
• Ultimate goal of removing all taxation. Everyone hates paying tax.
• Only natives may be citizens. Foreigners are guests and don't have equal rights to citizens.
• Foreigners not allowed to be in the media.

What does Woods' vanilla nationalism say about any of the above? And what does it say about the Jewish Question? Do nothing about the actual main root of the problems?

Woods has explained his reason for debunking (the falsehoods of) Europa: The Last Battle

I don't think I would describe him as a "vanilla nationalist", or someone who doesn't address the JQ

Good conversation. Woods doesn't want to debate Davis.

Stranger things have happened!

Of course, the two of them are old buddies and I think that they've been keeping it pretty civil. It would be great to see a debate though

 

[Ole Ror']

Analyzing AN2's arguments requires a careful look at the common themes within white supremacist doctrine and dogma. Here's my assessment:

AN2's Arguments and Their Relationship to White Supremacist Doctrine:

• Rehabilitating National Socialism:
  • This is a common tactic among neo-Nazis and white supremacists. They often attempt to separate the "positive" aspects of National Socialism (e.g., economic policies, perceived sense of national unity) from its genocidal aspects.
  • This allows them to present a more palatable version of the ideology to potential recruits.
• Emphasis on "Survival" and "Extinction":
  • The idea that white people are facing an existential threat of "extinction" due to immigration and demographic change is a core tenet of white supremacist ideology.
  • AN2's focus on "survival" aligns with this narrative.
• Focus on Economic Success:
  • The argument that National Socialism led to economic success in Germany is often used to justify the ideology, ignoring the exploitative and violent nature of the regime.
  • White supremacists often attempt to highlight the good aspects of the nazi regime, whilst ignoring the bad.
• Rejection of "Atrocity Focus":
  • The desire to move beyond the focus on the Holocaust and other atrocities is a common tactic among those seeking to minimize or deny the crimes of National Socialism.
  • This is a form of historical revisionism.
• "Alternative Visions" and Esoteric Influences:
  • The mention of Heinrich Himmler and Julius Evola points to the influence of esoteric and occult ideas within certain segments of the far-right.
  • These ideas are often used to create a sense of elitism and justify authoritarianism.
• German Chauvinism vs. "White Tribe":
  • The attempt to reconcile German chauvinism with a broader "white tribe" identity is a common struggle within white supremacist circles.
  • Some seek to emphasize a pan-European or "Aryan" identity, while others maintain a more nationalistic focus.

Conclusion:

• AN2's arguments are not original. They draw heavily from well-established white supremacist doctrines and talking points.
• The attempts to rehabilitate National Socialism, emphasize "survival," minimize atrocities, and explore esoteric influences are all hallmarks of this ideology.
• The use of the term "indigenous demographic decline" is a common white nationalist term.
• It is important to remember that these arguments are dangerous and should be challenged.

In essence, AN2 is employing familiar strategies used by white supremacists to promote their ideology, which is to attempt to make it more acceptable to a wider audience.

 

[céline]

In the same way Tony Blair changed left-wing politics forever I think so has Donald Trump done the same for right-wing politics.

 

[AN2]

Analyzing AN2's arguments requires a careful look at the common themes within white supremacist doctrine and dogma. Here's my assessment:

AN2's Arguments and Their Relationship to White Supremacist Doctrine:

• Rehabilitating National Socialism:
  • This is a common tactic among neo-Nazis and white supremacists. They often attempt to separate the "positive" aspects of National Socialism (e.g., economic policies, perceived sense of national unity) from its genocidal aspects.
  • This allows them to present a more palatable version of the ideology to potential recruits.
• Emphasis on "Survival" and "Extinction":
  • The idea that white people are facing an existential threat of "extinction" due to immigration and demographic change is a core tenet of white supremacist ideology.
  • AN2's focus on "survival" aligns with this narrative.
• Focus on Economic Success:
  • The argument that National Socialism led to economic success in Germany is often used to justify the ideology, ignoring the exploitative and violent nature of the regime.
  • White supremacists often attempt to highlight the good aspects of the nazi regime, whilst ignoring the bad.
• Rejection of "Atrocity Focus":
  • The desire to move beyond the focus on the Holocaust and other atrocities is a common tactic among those seeking to minimize or deny the crimes of National Socialism.
  • This is a form of historical revisionism.
• "Alternative Visions" and Esoteric Influences:
  • The mention of Heinrich Himmler and Julius Evola points to the influence of esoteric and occult ideas within certain segments of the far-right.
  • These ideas are often used to create a sense of elitism and justify authoritarianism.
• German Chauvinism vs. "White Tribe":
  • The attempt to reconcile German chauvinism with a broader "white tribe" identity is a common struggle within white supremacist circles.
  • Some seek to emphasize a pan-European or "Aryan" identity, while others maintain a more nationalistic focus.

Conclusion:

• AN2's arguments are not original. They draw heavily from well-established white supremacist doctrines and talking points.
• The attempts to rehabilitate National Socialism, emphasize "survival," minimize atrocities, and explore esoteric influences are all hallmarks of this ideology.
• The use of the term "indigenous demographic decline" is a common white nationalist term.
• It is important to remember that these arguments are dangerous and should be challenged.

In essence, AN2 is employing familiar strategies used by white supremacists to promote their ideology, which is to attempt to make it more acceptable to a wider audience.

Funnily enough, you seem oblivious to the fact that I haven't expressed any opinion of my own on NS in this thread..

But I've always just been a caricature to you

PS. Any chance you'll ever start using the actual definition of white supremacist? No? Ah well sure

 

[SwordOfStZip]

Funnily enough, you seem oblivious to the fact that I haven't expressed any opinion of my own on NS in this thread..

But I've always just been a caricature to you

PS. Any chance you'll ever start using the actual definition of white supremacist? No? Ah well sure

Do you recognise the handle "Ole Ror"?

The style seems to be that of a particular character recently Dresdened by Declan.

 

[AN2]

Do you recognize the handle "Ole Ror"?

Huh? I recognise (Queen's English please, we're not Americans ) it as roc. Spouting the same boilerplate gibberish he always does (I think @Donald J Trump is his cousin)

The style seems to be that of a particular character recently Dresdened by Declan.

Haha.. I like it

 

[SwordOfStZip]

• "Alternative Visions" and Esoteric Influences:
  • The mention of Heinrich Himmler and Julius Evola points to the influence of esoteric and occult ideas within certain segments of the far-right.
  • These ideas are often used to create a sense of elitism and justify authoritarianism.

For the Geeks Dr Alexander Jacob has translated four critiques of Evola by German intellectuals actually involved with the NSDAP. While Evola certainly did admire aspects of the NSDAP/Hitlerite regime other aspects of it put him off and that regime for it's part was at the very best deeply ambivalent about him, and in fact tended to be critical of him. There is a link to the amazon page of the volume below with a review that appeared in UNZ. I have not read it myself but I do think it is beneficial for people to read primary documents from that time as they often express angles, understandings, etc that might even be at first counter intuitive to us. I have not seen though much if anything in the way of Ariosophy from AN2 and I have the impression that he sees the majority at least of the Esoteric as girly silliness.

Julius Evola in the Third Reich: Amazon.co.uk: Jacob, Alexander: 9780645674538: Books

Buy Julius Evola in the Third Reich by Jacob, Alexander (ISBN: 9780645674538) from Amazon's Book Store. Everyday low prices and free delivery on eligible orders.

www.amazon.co.uk

New Book: Julius Evola in the Third Reich

Alexander Jacob’s book on Julius Evola as seen by four intellectuals in the Third Reich. From the Amazon blurb: How was Julius Evola viewed in the Third Reich? This book presents assessments made by 4 leading intellectuals of the regime: Walther Wüst, Joseph Otto Plassmann, Wolfram Sievers and...

www.unz.com

 

[SwordOfStZip]

Jews have been persecuted for centuries because they were often a visible minority with distinct beliefs and traditions, making them easy scapegoats for social, religious, and political tensions across different eras.

They have not been persecuted for centuries though. Yes they tended not to be in charge but relative the majority of the non-Jewish populations they lived amongst they tended to have positions of privilege- the whole thing about Jews being hated because of people being envious of them being claimed on one hand rather goes against claims of them being the most oppressed people ever on the other, do you not think? Yes there were short periods of intense persecution down through the centuries in Christian Europe but those we often primarily about class struggles as opposed to matters Religious or ethnic. Why the lingering hate and derision towards "peasants"?

 

[AN2]

For the Geeks Dr Alexander Jacob has translated four critiques of Evola by German intellectuals actually involved with the NSDAP. While Evola certainly did admire aspects of the NSDAP/Hitlerite regime other aspects of it put him off and that regime for it's part was at the very best deeply ambivalent about him, and in fact tended to be critical of him. There is a link to the amazon page of the volume below with a review that appeared in UNZ. I have not read it myself but I do think it is beneficial for people to read primary documents from that time as they often express angles, understandings, etc that might even be at first counter intuitive to us.

I have not seen though much if anything in the way of Ariosophy from AN2 and I have the impression that he sees the majority at least of the Esoteric as girly silliness.

I don't even know what that means

I'm not particularly (philosophically) well read by any means, nor am I particularly impressed by people who are. I don't think that Keith Woods is a genius

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[SwordOfStZip]

I don't even know what that means

I'm not particularly (philosophically) well read by any means, nor am I particularly impressed by people who are. I don't think Keith Woods is a genius

I think you would consider it to be mumbo-jumbo (a significant amount of it is). It is speculations about Runes, etc and the ancient history and origins of the Aryans so to speak as opposed to Philosophy in the more strict and narrow senses. The degree of it's influence within and over the NSDAP is something often hotly debated.

Ariosophy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[AN2]

I think you would consider it to be mumbo-jumbo

I think astrology is mumbo-jumbo

(a significant amount of it is). It is speculations about Runes, etc and the ancient history and origins of the Aryans so to speak as opposed to Philosophy in the more strict and narrow senses. The degree of it's influence within and over the NSDAP is something often hotly debated.

Ariosophy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yeah, it wouldn't appeal to me, Aryan doesn't appeal to me

A certain amount of this debate of course is that NS belongs to a bygone era and not relevant to today

 

[Lazarus]

Analyzing AN2's arguments requires a careful look at the common themes within white supremacist doctrine and dogma. Here's my assessment:

AN2's Arguments and Their Relationship to White Supremacist Doctrine:

• Rehabilitating National Socialism:
  • This is a common tactic among neo-Nazis and white supremacists. They often attempt to separate the "positive" aspects of National Socialism (e.g., economic policies, perceived sense of national unity) from its genocidal aspects.
  • This allows them to present a more palatable version of the ideology to potential recruits.
• Emphasis on "Survival" and "Extinction":
  • The idea that white people are facing an existential threat of "extinction" due to immigration and demographic change is a core tenet of white supremacist ideology.
  • AN2's focus on "survival" aligns with this narrative.
• Focus on Economic Success:
  • The argument that National Socialism led to economic success in Germany is often used to justify the ideology, ignoring the exploitative and violent nature of the regime.
  • White supremacists often attempt to highlight the good aspects of the nazi regime, whilst ignoring the bad.
• Rejection of "Atrocity Focus":
  • The desire to move beyond the focus on the Holocaust and other atrocities is a common tactic among those seeking to minimize or deny the crimes of National Socialism.
  • This is a form of historical revisionism.
• "Alternative Visions" and Esoteric Influences:
  • The mention of Heinrich Himmler and Julius Evola points to the influence of esoteric and occult ideas within certain segments of the far-right.
  • These ideas are often used to create a sense of elitism and justify authoritarianism.
• German Chauvinism vs. "White Tribe":
  • The attempt to reconcile German chauvinism with a broader "white tribe" identity is a common struggle within white supremacist circles.
  • Some seek to emphasize a pan-European or "Aryan" identity, while others maintain a more nationalistic focus.

Conclusion:

• AN2's arguments are not original. They draw heavily from well-established white supremacist doctrines and talking points.
• The attempts to rehabilitate National Socialism, emphasize "survival," minimize atrocities, and explore esoteric influences are all hallmarks of this ideology.
• The use of the term "indigenous demographic decline" is a common white nationalist term.
• It is important to remember that these arguments are dangerous and should be challenged.

In essence, AN2 is employing familiar strategies used by white supremacists to promote their ideology, which is to attempt to make it more acceptable to a wider audience.

Nobody cares.

Get a hobby you sad bastard.

 

[AN2]

Nobody cares.

Get a hobby you sad bastard.

Looks like he was Dresdened by Declan

And this after Dull Dave forbade the Gowl from accessing PIsle (I told you - you never know who you can trust)

Overall, It's been a bad day for the losers

 

[Fishalt]

Looks like he was Dresdened by Declan

And this after Dull Dave forbade the Gowl from accessing PIsle (I told you - you never know who you can trust)

Overall, It's been a bad day for the losers

Looks like it's down again.

Got a 403 from the address just now.

 

[AUL LAD]

I've read Woods' second essay and skimmed through some of the other essays he quoted, and their arguments against NS don't really go beyond Hitler and his military failures. Nothing about the economic principles or other tenets of NS. Basically, NS = Hitler = bad optics = not sellable to win votes.

Saying NS is bad optics is stating the obvious and you'd expect something more substantial from the political nerds such as Woods. He says he doesn't want to become the "anti-NS guy", but he is the one who started this exchange with Davis, and he also made a debunking post about Europa: The Last Battle. He's dismisses NS as nothing but LARPing like Star Trek fans, a "history hobby", not relevant because its from the 1930s (appeal to novelty btw), even though he agrees with Artistotle, "favouring a classical republican regime over a dictatorship" which is thousands of years ago, and the ancient Greeks were imperial expansionists, literally trying to take over the world (Alexander the Great).

I'm not going to claim NS is a perfect ideology without any negative ideas or potential for a slippery slope descent into terrible consequences. But to address the argument that NS is not sellable, I would say there are many positive ideas that would appeal to Irish people and nationalists in general:

• No interest on loans, no usury. Interest-free mortgages and loans for businesses. Is there a man alive that enjoys paying interest on their mortgage?
• Anti communism, anti marxism and anti capitalism.
• Anti freemasonry.
• Special protection for Christians.
• Right of arms for citizens.
• No income/profit without work, i.e. no speculation allowed, e.g. buying property to sell it at profit without doing anything. Businesses not to be operated for maximum profit for shareholders.
• No dole, no lifetime dole scroungers.
• Ultimate goal of removing all taxation. Everyone hates paying tax.
• Only natives may be citizens. Foreigners are guests and don't have equal rights to citizens.
• Foreigners not allowed to be in the media.

What does Woods' vanilla nationalism say about any of the above? And what does it say about the Jewish Question? Do nothing about the actual main root of the problems?


Good conversation. Woods doesn't want to debate Davis.

excellent post it draws attention to the measures taken to rescue Germany from the weimar republic .
in 1933 Germans only owned 11 of the 155 banking companies in Germany less than 10 % of their own financial system and their currency was controlled from new York.
feeding the German people is not a crime but there are those who would disagree .
today in the world we are being threatened by the Jews on many fronts --it is warfare against humanity worldwide .
the war in Ukraine is a Jewish war where zelenksys backer/controller is a dual citizen with Israel as are Victoria nuland who bribed the Ukrainian army with 5 billion and can be heard online ( just type in F THE EU SPEECH) picking the present UKRAINIAN GOVERNMENT AND !!! OPPOSITION with USA ambassador geffory pyatt .
and anthony blinken and zslenksy are jewish and wanted to blow up two nuclear power plants in kursk HERE IN OUR EUROPE .
today war with iran which will close the straits of hormuz and destroy our economy is at an advanced stage with vast resources being gathered in deigo garcia and europe and the middle east .
Vincent Brown - ""-the Israelis are a cancer in the middle east""
all because israel wants to destroy the palestinians

 

[SwordOfStZip]

I don't even know what that means

I'm not particularly (philosophically) well read by any means, nor am I particularly impressed by people who are. I don't think that Keith Woods is a genius

roc_ sent me a private message on P.ie- there is a first time for everything- demanding that I tell you, and he was extremely abusive towards you, that post 106 on this thread was the product of AI. I am convinced he was being dishonest there, my first reaction to that claim was "another lie from you"- and than I thought for a moment and it occured to me that roc_ himself is rather like an AI program ("Computer please create for me a neurotic Irish Gen X paranoid Zio"). A big reason for that I believe is his neglect of Philosophy. We all work off presuppositons, basically a Philosophical paradigm, and it is a very good idea to unpack and examine your presuppositions to see if they are rational, nurturing, etc or not.