Ukraine.

[Wolf]

Do you even know the point you are trying to make?

Have you no life, Pervert?
Seriously, Jimmy 2.

 

[Mad as Fish]

Do you even know the point you are trying to make?

Stop bloody obfuscating.

 

[Mad as Fish]

Have you no life, Pervert?
Seriously, Jimmy 2.

It has an existence, one that involves slipping around the a'holes of the establishment and licking whichever is in most need of comfort from the invertebrate.

 

[Mad as Fish]

Talking of HIMARS and stuff -

HIMARS carries a single six-pack of GMLRS rockets or one TACMS missile, according to Lockheed Martin. Individual GMLRS rockets cost about $100,000

Whereas -

The value of the announced deal was about 33 million euros. That is, one 155-mm projectile under this contract costs 3.3 thousand euros.

No wonder Trump wants Europe to pay for it all.

Who makes HIMARS and how much do missile launchers cost?

Ukrainian forces have successfully used the rocket launchers to strike ammunition depots, bridges and other key targets, hindering Russia's war effort.

www.newsweek.com

How Much 155mm Ammunition Costs Now: an Example of the Rheinmetall Contract For 10,000 Shells | Defense Express

Prices for 155mm ammunition were not democratic earlier, but now they have started to gallop

en.defence-ua.com

 

[Mad as Fish]

While we armchair generals get all excited about drones, out on the battlefield problems are emerging.

Ukraine's drone operators say they have to negotiate safe passage past friendly jammers, sometimes over group chat

Ukraine needs to be able to jam Russia's drones. But that means its own drone pilots need to negotiate safe passage through the jamming.

www.businessinsider.com

Standard artillery shells, however, are not affected, but there is a shortage of those......

 

[Wolf]

So no Tomahawks for little Zitler.....

Zelensky 'realistic' about US Tomahawks after Trump talks

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said he was "realistic" on chances of receiving US Tomahawk missiles after President Donald Trump told him he did not want escalation.

www.rte.ie

 

[Haven]

@Mad as Fish , you need some education.

Tube artillery does have a place on the battlefield. However you need to understand CEP.

Radically Rethinking The Field Artillery

The era of Great Power competition and confrontation has returned. The United States and its Western friends and allies face an increasingly hostile and assertive alliance of The People’s Republic of China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, and their surrogates.

www.hoover.org

"The mainstay of U.S. Field Artillery is cannon fire which mainly consists of exploding 155-millimeter projectiles. Fired at maximum ranges, conventional cannon artillery has a Circular Error Probable (CEP) of more than 250 meters.[1] As shown in Figure 1, CEP is the distance from a target at which 50% of fired rounds will land beyond, and 50% will land inside of the intended target."

This is technical way of saying you need to fire a lot of rounds to guarantee some damage to the target. And it also takes time.

"Using conventional artillery ammunition, a Field Artillery unit would need to fire 43 rounds (4,800 lbs.) of ammunition to have a 57% probability of destroying an enemy platoon. The engagement would take about 30 minutes and require at least 6 howitzers and 34 soldiers".

The war in Ukraine has shown you dont get 30 minutes to sit there and fire your rounds. You will be targetted by counter battery fire or drones.

Then your losses in terms of fired rounds, killed soldiers and destroyed tubes is considerably more than 3.3K EUR.

So, while rockets may be more expensive individually, they are more accurate, they are way faster to shoot and scoot, and a matter you dont address, they have longer range. It adds up to a far more survivable package.

Professional militaries around the world have done these calculations and are opting for HiMARS-like systems.

 

[Wolf]

@Mad as Fish , you need some education.

Tube artillery does have a place on the battlefield. However you need to understand CEP.

Radically Rethinking The Field Artillery

The era of Great Power competition and confrontation has returned. The United States and its Western friends and allies face an increasingly hostile and assertive alliance of The People’s Republic of China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, and their surrogates.

www.hoover.org

"The mainstay of U.S. Field Artillery is cannon fire which mainly consists of exploding 155-millimeter projectiles. Fired at maximum ranges, conventional cannon artillery has a Circular Error Probable (CEP) of more than 250 meters.[1] As shown in Figure 1, CEP is the distance from a target at which 50% of fired rounds will land beyond, and 50% will land inside of the intended target."

This is technical way of saying you need to fire a lot of rounds to guarantee some damage to the target. And it also takes time.

"Using conventional artillery ammunition, a Field Artillery unit would need to fire 43 rounds (4,800 lbs.) of ammunition to have a 57% probability of destroying an enemy platoon. The engagement would take about 30 minutes and require at least 6 howitzers and 34 soldiers".

The war in Ukraine has shown you dont get 30 minutes to sit there and fire your rounds. You will be targetted by counter battery fire or drones.

Then your losses in terms of fired rounds, killed soldiers and destroyed tubes is considerably more than 3.3K EUR.

So, while rockets may be more expensive individually, they are more accurate, they are way faster to shoot and scoot, and a matter you dont address, they have longer range. It adds up to a far more survivable package.

Professional militaries around the world have done these calculations and are opting for HiMARS-like systems.

Google is your only friend, Pervert

 

[Haven]

Google is your only friend, Pervert

I think this is a "sneering attitude ". Im sure jpc will be along shortly to address this.

 

[Mad as Fish]

@Mad as Fish , you need some education.

Tube artillery does have a place on the battlefield. However you need to understand CEP.

Radically Rethinking The Field Artillery

The era of Great Power competition and confrontation has returned. The United States and its Western friends and allies face an increasingly hostile and assertive alliance of The People’s Republic of China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, and their surrogates.

www.hoover.org

"The mainstay of U.S. Field Artillery is cannon fire which mainly consists of exploding 155-millimeter projectiles. Fired at maximum ranges, conventional cannon artillery has a Circular Error Probable (CEP) of more than 250 meters.[1] As shown in Figure 1, CEP is the distance from a target at which 50% of fired rounds will land beyond, and 50% will land inside of the intended target."

This is technical way of saying you need to fire a lot of rounds to guarantee some damage to the target. And it also takes time.

"Using conventional artillery ammunition, a Field Artillery unit would need to fire 43 rounds (4,800 lbs.) of ammunition to have a 57% probability of destroying an enemy platoon. The engagement would take about 30 minutes and require at least 6 howitzers and 34 soldiers".

The war in Ukraine has shown you dont get 30 minutes to sit there and fire your rounds. You will be targetted by counter battery fire or drones.

Then your losses in terms of fired rounds, killed soldiers and destroyed tubes is considerably more than 3.3K EUR.

So, while rockets may be more expensive individually, they are more accurate, they are way faster to shoot and scoot, and a matter you dont address, they have longer range. It adds up to a far more survivable package.

Professional militaries around the world have done these calculations and are opting for HiMARS-like systems.

Hahaha..... Standard globalist/establishment crap. As soon as the narrative is challenged then one needs 'educating'. Had this argument with a lad in a another place and he was far brighter than you boyo, but at least he had the grace to go away when caught acting all superior.

 

[Mad as Fish]

Google is your only friend, Pervert

Oh I dunno, he's probably developing a deep and loving relationship with ChatGPT as well.

 

[Haven]

Hahaha..... Standard globalist/establishment crap. As soon as the narrative is challenged then one needs 'educating'. Had this argument with a lad in a another place and he was far brighter than you boyo, but at least he had the grace to go away when caught acting all superior.

Instead of spoofing, did you want to try explain what you think is wrong with my post?

 

[Wolf]

Instead of spoofing, did you want to try explain what you think is wrong with my post?

It's bullshit trolling as usual, trying to drag people down another one of your stupid fucking rabbit holes, Pervert.

 

[Wolf]

Oh I dunno, he's probably developing a deep and loving relationship with ChatGPT as well.

TINA!

 

[Wolf]

Trump is trying to cool heads as Zitler and the clowns in the EU are trying to escalate this pointless wankfest of a war.

Trump-Zelensky meeting was ‘bad’ – Axios​

The Ukrainian leader left Washington without promises on Tomahawk missiles, the outlet’s sources say

Ukrainian leader Vladimir Zelensky attends a meeting with US President Donald Trump at the White House on October 17, 2025, in Washington, DC. © Getty Images
\
Friday's White House meeting between US President Donald Trump and Vladimir Zelensky was “tense,” with the Ukrainian leader failing to secure deliveries of long-range Tomahawk missiles, Axios has reported, citing sources.
Trump told Zelensky he does not plan to provide Tomahawks “at least for now,” according to two people briefed on the meeting. The talks lasted around two and a half hours and were described by one source as “not easy,” and by another as “bad.” At times, the discussion “got a bit emotional,” the outlet said.
”Nobody shouted, but Trump was tough,” one source told Axios. The session ended abruptly when Trump reportedly said, “I think we’re done. Let’s see what happens next week,” possibly referring to upcoming Russia-US talks.

Speaking to reporters afterwards, Zelensky declined to answer questions about Tomahawk deliveries, only saying the US “does not want escalation.”
Trump said “it’s not easy” for Washington to provide the missiles because it needs to maintain its own supplies for the nation’s own defense. He also acknowledged that allowing Kiev to conduct strikes deep into Russia could lead to an escalation.
Moscow has warned against supplying the missiles to Ukraine, arguing they would “not change the situation on the battlefield” but would “severely undermine the prospects of a peaceful settlement” and harm Russia-US relations.
Zelensky has sought Tomahawks – which have a maximum range of 2,500km (1,550 miles) – for weeks, insisting that Ukraine would only use them against military targets to increase pressure on Russia and move toward a peace deal. However, the Ukrainian leader has threatened Russia with blackouts in border regions and Moscow. Russian officials also suggested that Kiev is plotting to use the missiles for “terrorist attacks.”
The Trump-Zelensky meeting followed a phone call between Trump and Putin, after which both sides signaled plans for a summit in Budapest, Hungary, in the near future.

 

[Wolf]

LOL, these psychopaths are going to impoverish every EU citizen with their bullshit.

EU preparing ‘space shield’ against Russia – draft paper​

The project is part of Brussels’ Defense Readiness Roadmap, and aims to protect the bloc’s military and communications satellites in case of conflict

© Getty Images / enot-poloskun

The EU plans to establish a ‘space shield’ to protect its satellites from Russia, the European Commission has revealed.
The Defense Readiness Roadmap draft unveiled on Thursday describes the project as the EU’s response to the “evolving threat landscape” from a “militarized Russia” and other “authoritarian states,” as the US shifts its focus away from Europe.
Russia has dismissed claims that it poses a threat as “nonsense,” accusing the West of fueling Russophobia to justify increased military spending and distract from domestic problems.
According to the paper, the space shield will be integrated with the EU’s satellite navigation and communications systems. It will focus on space domain awareness, anti-jamming and spoofing, and in-space operations such as refueling, where “Europe has clear shortfalls and dependencies.”
Brussels has not yet disclosed a budget for the initiative or listed member states and industrial partners involved.

The plan follows accusations from the UK, Germany, and France that Russia has stalked or tried to jam their military satellites. Moscow has not yet commented, but has consistently opposed weaponizing space, stressing that its operations comply with international law.
The roadmap builds on the ReArm Europe package, which aims to mobilize up to €800 billion ($933 billion) to expand the EU’s military on the pretext of countering the alleged ‘Russian threat’.
Alongside the space shield, it outlines plans to reinforce the bloc’s eastern border, create a bloc-wide missile defense system, and establish a ‘drone wall’, which was prompted by sightings in several member states that were baselessly blamed on Russia.
The paper also calls Ukraine the EU’s “first line of defense” and pledges “continued support,” despite Moscow’s warnings that foreign military aid only serves to prolong the conflict.
The plan will be discussed at a summit of EU leaders next week. According to the document, the commission hopes to have the roadmap approved by the end of 2025.
READ MORE: Russia completes ground tests of new space rocket (VIDEO)
Russian officials have condemned the EU’s “rabid militarization,” warning it could derail peace efforts and spark a wider conflict. Foreign Ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova said earlier this month that the “hype” around the ‘Russian threat’ is being used by EU countries to justify direct confrontation.

 

[Mad as Fish]

Instead of spoofing, did you want to try explain what you think is wrong with my post?

Just pointed out exactly what was wrong with it.

 

[jpc]

Im just giving it back. Sneering is what every poster here does. Im actually tame in comparison.

But its a very dumb take all the same, as Ive clearly explained. Tube artillery does not have the power, flexibility or reach that rocket systems have.

Everyone is buying or building.

Multi-barrel Rocket Launcher Market Size, Share | Report [2032]

The global multi-barrel rocket launcher market size was valued at $2.39 billion in 2023 & is expected to grow from $2.46 billion in 2024 to $3.40 billion by 2032

www.fortunebusinessinsights.com

MAF had no counterargument.


What just happened to "What's not fine is your sneering attitude to a poster."


Sure.

I assume this will apply to everyone here from now on.

But of course, it wont.

LOL, these psychopaths are going to impoverish every EU citizen with their bullshit.

EU preparing ‘space shield’ against Russia – draft paper​

The project is part of Brussels’ Defense Readiness Roadmap, and aims to protect the bloc’s military and communications satellites in case of conflict

© Getty Images / enot-poloskun

The EU plans to establish a ‘space shield’ to protect its satellites from Russia, the European Commission has revealed.
The Defense Readiness Roadmap draft unveiled on Thursday describes the project as the EU’s response to the “evolving threat landscape” from a “militarized Russia” and other “authoritarian states,” as the US shifts its focus away from Europe.
Russia has dismissed claims that it poses a threat as “nonsense,” accusing the West of fueling Russophobia to justify increased military spending and distract from domestic problems.
According to the paper, the space shield will be integrated with the EU’s satellite navigation and communications systems. It will focus on space domain awareness, anti-jamming and spoofing, and in-space operations such as refueling, where “Europe has clear shortfalls and dependencies.”
Brussels has not yet disclosed a budget for the initiative or listed member states and industrial partners involved.

The plan follows accusations from the UK, Germany, and France that Russia has stalked or tried to jam their military satellites. Moscow has not yet commented, but has consistently opposed weaponizing space, stressing that its operations comply with international law.
The roadmap builds on the ReArm Europe package, which aims to mobilize up to €800 billion ($933 billion) to expand the EU’s military on the pretext of countering the alleged ‘Russian threat’.
Alongside the space shield, it outlines plans to reinforce the bloc’s eastern border, create a bloc-wide missile defense system, and establish a ‘drone wall’, which was prompted by sightings in several member states that were baselessly blamed on Russia.
The paper also calls Ukraine the EU’s “first line of defense” and pledges “continued support,” despite Moscow’s warnings that foreign military aid only serves to prolong the conflict.
The plan will be discussed at a summit of EU leaders next week. According to the document, the commission hopes to have the roadmap approved by the end of 2025.
READ MORE: Russia completes ground tests of new space rocket (VIDEO)
Russian officials have condemned the EU’s “rabid militarization,” warning it could derail peace efforts and spark a wider conflict. Foreign Ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova said earlier this month that the “hype” around the ‘Russian threat’ is being used by EU countries to justify direct confrontation.

A good way to bankrupt Europe.

 

[Declan]

Have you no life, Pervert?
Seriously, Jimmy 2.

I have enough of the Pervery bullshit.

 

[Mad as Fish]

A good way to bankrupt Europe.

This exemplifies exactly what is wrong with empires such as the EU. When all accountability is lost, or the need to consider the wishes of the electorate is simply not factored into decisions, then lunacy prevails. It is the greatest threat of a one world government, it will greatly accelerate our fall to simple swine of the forests of industry and commerce.

 

[Mad as Fish]

I have enough of the Pervery bullshit.

Are you ridding the site of Tank and his iterations so? It needs to be done. One can look back at older threads and see a much greater richness of posters and opinion, and while everyone is entitled to their views, when one character comes to push a narrative and makes itself obnoxious to the extent that it deters others from carrying on the debate then the boil needs to be lanced.

 

[Haven]

Blackout for blackout: Ukraine punches back for Russian attacks

Ukraine has built up its own long-range strike capability and is now punishing Russia for its attacks.

www.politico.eu