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Who really killed Michael Collins?
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<blockquote data-quote="scolairebocht" data-source="post: 8917" data-attributes="member: 8"><p>Many thanks Anderson et al, anyway just to rehash some points there in case they are a little confusing:</p><p></p><p>Immediately before the outbreak of the Civil War the anti-Treaty side were supplied by arms given to them by Collins from British Army stocks that the Free State were getting. This seemed to happen all across Ireland and on a large scale.</p><p></p><p>From Collins' perspective, its supposed to be a swap, he gives them these arms, they give him whatever miscellaneous arms they have and he gives the latter to the Ulster IRA or stores them in dumps along the Border in preparation for an assault on the Six Counties. If the arms are captured or discovered by the British, they will blame the anti-Treaty side, because that's where the guns came from, and not Collins and the Irish government.</p><p></p><p>So far so good, but realistically, if people like Emmet Dalton were working for British Intelligence, then the British knew all long that this was happening. Personally I don't think they would have disliked this initially, because it served to arm the anti-Treaty side which encouraged them to fight the Civil War that I think the British wanted to see fought. (Remember, in theory this is just a 'swap' of weapons, but realistically where are the anti-Treaty side going to get large amounts of high quality weapons and equipment before this? During the War of Independence rifles, and where they had them, ammunition, were like gold dust, very rare and hard to come by. So when they get supplied from the Free State/ British Army stocks like this, it looks much more like arming the anti-Treaty side rather than just 'swapping' them.)</p><p></p><p>But Collins it seems was all along determined to turn this into an attack on the Six Counties and the British would clearly have to stop this. That comes across very much from the record of those months, and anyway we had the Boundary Commission coming down the tracks, which the British already no doubt were hay working but knew that Collins would never tolerate any back sliding on.</p><p></p><p>Also, just to reiterate again, remember too about Wilson. A Field Marshal, Baronet and MP, he had been the Chief of the Imperial General Staff, the very head of the British army, and was gunned down in cold blood on a London Street. While the British would go along with the fiction that it was the anti-Treaty side, for the purpose of starting the Civil War, they weren't fooled, it had Collins' men and method all over it, and it was, for them, unforgivable.</p><p></p><p>Hence Béal na Blath was no accident or random death in my opinion.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="scolairebocht, post: 8917, member: 8"] Many thanks Anderson et al, anyway just to rehash some points there in case they are a little confusing: Immediately before the outbreak of the Civil War the anti-Treaty side were supplied by arms given to them by Collins from British Army stocks that the Free State were getting. This seemed to happen all across Ireland and on a large scale. From Collins' perspective, its supposed to be a swap, he gives them these arms, they give him whatever miscellaneous arms they have and he gives the latter to the Ulster IRA or stores them in dumps along the Border in preparation for an assault on the Six Counties. If the arms are captured or discovered by the British, they will blame the anti-Treaty side, because that's where the guns came from, and not Collins and the Irish government. So far so good, but realistically, if people like Emmet Dalton were working for British Intelligence, then the British knew all long that this was happening. Personally I don't think they would have disliked this initially, because it served to arm the anti-Treaty side which encouraged them to fight the Civil War that I think the British wanted to see fought. (Remember, in theory this is just a 'swap' of weapons, but realistically where are the anti-Treaty side going to get large amounts of high quality weapons and equipment before this? During the War of Independence rifles, and where they had them, ammunition, were like gold dust, very rare and hard to come by. So when they get supplied from the Free State/ British Army stocks like this, it looks much more like arming the anti-Treaty side rather than just 'swapping' them.) But Collins it seems was all along determined to turn this into an attack on the Six Counties and the British would clearly have to stop this. That comes across very much from the record of those months, and anyway we had the Boundary Commission coming down the tracks, which the British already no doubt were hay working but knew that Collins would never tolerate any back sliding on. Also, just to reiterate again, remember too about Wilson. A Field Marshal, Baronet and MP, he had been the Chief of the Imperial General Staff, the very head of the British army, and was gunned down in cold blood on a London Street. While the British would go along with the fiction that it was the anti-Treaty side, for the purpose of starting the Civil War, they weren't fooled, it had Collins' men and method all over it, and it was, for them, unforgivable. Hence Béal na Blath was no accident or random death in my opinion. [/QUOTE]
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