Origins Thread

Do you believe in evolution?


  • Total voters
    13

Mad as Fish

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2023
Messages
4,110
Reaction score
5,628
As humans, we must acknowledge the limitations of our understanding when confronted with the vastness and complexity of the universe. It’s humbling to recognise that there are aspects of existence that may elude our comprehension, regardless of our efforts to grasp them.

However that should not limit our ability to question the conventional wisdom on certain theories that are full of holes.
Indeed not, and my fear is that those who do ask the basic and most important questions are increasingly denied an audience because there are too many vested interests wishing to see the status quo continue indefinitely.

However, it is encouraging to see that tenet of astrophysics, the big bang, now having to be revised as our knowledge of science increases.
 

PlunkettsGhost

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2023
Messages
3,923
Reaction score
3,763
How does a vertical tree trunk manage to fossilize itself through multiple strata of rock, when the official narrative is that said strata take eons to be laid down on top of one another?

Is the official geologic timeline Bollox?
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
How does a vertical tree trunk manage to fossilize itself through multiple strata of rock, when the official narrative is that said strata take eons to be laid down on top of one another?

Is the official geologic timeline Bollox?
Normally this is explained away as being a result of tectonic activity, however there are clearly examples where this is a poor explanation.
 
Last edited:
Z

Zipporah's Flint

Guest


I think that calls for a thread of it's own. I have noticed that parts of the Ruling Elites in the West want to revive the type of "Muscular" (Theologically) Liberal Protestantism that you had in England between the last third of Victoria's reign to World War I and in Germany during the Wilhelmine Era. The thing is that the only Liberal Protestant thinkers of the 20 th century of real meat and merit- Paul Althaus and Emanuel Hirsch- were both not just members of the NSADP but avowed Hitlerites (particularly the latter who I think was the most talented). I find people like Dawkins wanting to cynically use Christianity for their own (sinister?) purposes smacks actually of Antichrist.
 
Z

Zipporah's Flint

Guest
His influence is mainly over the Novus Ordo church of paganism.

Do you mean people still claim to be Catholics or actual Witches?

In England and France I know outside of people in their 80s and 70s no one who claims to be Catholic is interested in him but actual Witches are interested in him.
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Do you mean people still claim to be Catholics or actual Witches?

In England and France I know outside of people in their 80s and 70s no one who claims to be Catholic is interested in him but actual Witches are interested in him.
All of the priests formed since the 1960’s have been taught based on his ideas.

My uncle was a priest. His ordination card had Teilhard pictured and quoted on the back.
 

scolairebocht

Moderator
Staff member
Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
1,083
Reaction score
1,362
The Occult world claim the Jesuits as part of their realm now, because of the influence of Teilhard, hence what Zipporah says about real witches quoting him is unfortunately quite believable.
 

Fishalt

Well-known member
New
Joined
Mar 13, 2023
Messages
2,419
Reaction score
2,692
Do you mean people still claim to be Catholics or actual Witches?

In England and France I know outside of people in their 80s and 70s no one who claims to be Catholic is interested in him but actual Witches are interested in him.
The concept of witches and witchcraft is very modern. Historically, most women who were considered witches were simply isolated poor women living in the outskirts of poverty because their husbands died early in the game. Often times they would take small mammals etc as pets, for company, which is where the concept of familiars comes from.
 
Z

Zipporah's Flint

Guest
The concept of witches and witchcraft is very modern. Historically, most women who were considered witches were simply isolated poor women living in the outskirts of poverty because their husbands died early in the game. Often times they would take small mammals etc as pets, for company, which is where the concept of familiars comes from.

Nearly all the people executed in Ireland for Witchcraft came from the Upper Classes.


And it was not only in Ireland that things were similar most of the time-

 

scolairebocht

Moderator
Staff member
Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2021
Messages
1,083
Reaction score
1,362
Its also a minuscule number of people executed for witchcraft, or by Catholic Church authorities in general, in Ireland (I think about 5 people over 1,600 years of history). Its much more a feature of more Protestant countries.
 

Fishalt

Well-known member
New
Joined
Mar 13, 2023
Messages
2,419
Reaction score
2,692
Nearly all the people executed in Ireland for Witchcraft came from the Upper Classes.


And it was not only in Ireland that things were similar most of the time-

This is nonsense, I'm afraid. The vast majority of women executed for witchcraft were decidedly not upper class. In fact, the vast majority of witch hunts happened in poor rural areas. They tended to be peasant wives, often widowed. Keep in mind this was occurring at the burgeoning of industrialization, and many of these women were likely economic refugees in their own host nations:

Federici (2018), Larner (1984) and Bange (2010) also stress the element of poverty in accused women. Female beggars (Bange, 2010), widowed women, wise women (Federici 2004, p.200), and folk healers including midwives (Larner, 1984) were especially at risk. What these women usually had in common, was that they were of old age and poor. Wise women and folk healers 24 were usually older women in rural communities, who had been around for long enough to have collected a wide knowledge on healing plants, conception, birth, birth control and even abortion (Federici, 2004). They posed a threat towards the Church’ ideology on fertility. In larger towns and cities, female beggars were more common. When they were found to be too “disturbing” in their begging, and especially when they were widowed, they risked being accused of witchery (Bange, 2010). If these women were deemed social outcasts, or had already been suspected of witchcraft, it was likely that they resorted to small, simple houses outside the town to not draw attention. However, this could increase suspicions of witchery (Borman, 2015, p.40).

Monballyu (2015) collected the profiles of thirty-one people who were tried for witchcraft. I counted twenty-six women, the youngest being 40 years old, of whom fourteen were widowed. Fifteen of these women, of whom nine widows, were killed by burning them to death. The occupation of the women, or their (former) husbands’, were often not known. If they were known, it usually involved trade in fruit, milk, butter, or fish. Among the men, one, whose age was not known, was sent to jail with his wife, who was also accused of witchery. a 45-year-old man, who owned several houses, was burnt, just like his daughter, who was previously accused of witchery. A 52-year-old farmer was tried but not killed, and a baker of unknown age was burnt. A 58-year-old fruit seller was burnt. All but one man were married. In the Geneva trials between 1571 and 1572, thirty-five people were tried as a witch, for causing a plague epidemic. All accused witches or their spouses, whose occupation was known, were labourers and craftsmen (Monter, 1976)
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354

Spot on.​

https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinio...w-he-still-doesnt-get-it/?utm_source=telegram

Atheist Richard Dawkins’s latest ‘culturally Christian’ comments show he still doesn’t get it​


Liberalism is the attempt to continue Christianity without Christ. Like Matthew Arnold before him, Dawkins sees in Christianity a poetic beauty having no essential truth.
Featured Image
Richard DawkinsAl Teich/Shutterstock

Frank Wright
Comments
12
Wed Apr 3, 2024 - 5:02 pm EDT

(LifeSiteNews) — British biologist and militant atheist Richard Dawkins has once again professed the value of Christianity – minus Christ, of course.
He chose the Easter Triduum, the pinnacle of the liturgical year which commemorates the central mystery of the Catholic faith, to remind the world that he thinks of himself as a “Cultural Christian.”

lg.php


What this means to him is simply that Christianity, as he misunderstands it, is now liberal, and therefore pleasing to him.
“I like to live in a culturally Christian country, though I do not believe a single word of the Christian faith,” said Dawkins.
He says that by contrast, the doctrine of Islam is “fundamentally hostile to women, hostile to gays.”
The culture that Dawkins is defending here is that of the rights-based religion of reason. This is nothing new, as the tradition to which he belongs is an attempt to replace the divine with itself.
 
Z

Zipporah's Flint

Guest

Spot on.​

https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinio...w-he-still-doesnt-get-it/?utm_source=telegram

Atheist Richard Dawkins’s latest ‘culturally Christian’ comments show he still doesn’t get it​


Liberalism is the attempt to continue Christianity without Christ. Like Matthew Arnold before him, Dawkins sees in Christianity a poetic beauty having no essential truth.
Featured Image
Richard DawkinsAl Teich/Shutterstock

Frank Wright
Comments
12
Wed Apr 3, 2024 - 5:02 pm EDT

(LifeSiteNews) — British biologist and militant atheist Richard Dawkins has once again professed the value of Christianity – minus Christ, of course.
He chose the Easter Triduum, the pinnacle of the liturgical year which commemorates the central mystery of the Catholic faith, to remind the world that he thinks of himself as a “Cultural Christian.”

lg.php


What this means to him is simply that Christianity, as he misunderstands it, is now liberal, and therefore pleasing to him.
“I like to live in a culturally Christian country, though I do not believe a single word of the Christian faith,” said Dawkins.
He says that by contrast, the doctrine of Islam is “fundamentally hostile to women, hostile to gays.”
The culture that Dawkins is defending here is that of the rights-based religion of reason. This is nothing new, as the tradition to which he belongs is an attempt to replace the divine with itself.

I don't think that Liberalism is an attempt to continue Christianity without Christ at all. The New Testament (read the first chapter of the Epistle to the Romans) I think clearly says that not just people who engage in homosexual acts deserve the death penalty but those approve of homosexual carry on deserve it as well- contrast that with the Koran which actually says nothing about homosexuality on the face of it which is why historically the Muslim world has been a lot more tolerant of homosexual carry on than Christendom. You could make a much better argument that Socialism and Fascism were seeking Christianity without Christ to to speak (there are strong arguments that Bolshevikism was essentially a Christian heresy and Hitlerism was a Rabbinic Jewish heresy- Jews themselves have made those arguments).
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Prevailing scientific assumptions often die hard, especially when they fit so neatly into an evolutionary view of the development of life on earth. On this episode of ID The Future from the archive (link below) Dr. Casey Luskin gives host Andrew McDiarmid the scoop on one of the biggest mistakes in science of our lifetime: the concept of “junk DNA.”

The myth of junk DNA is a major example of why a Darwinian paradigm can slow the progress of science, while a design perspective can open up new avenues for research and discovery.

In this update, Luskin explains that intelligent design theorists have long argued against the idea that non-protein coding DNA is useless evolutionary junk, instead predicting that it serves important biological functions. Year after year for decades, new evidence has emerged revealing such functions and vindicating ID scientists. Luskin summarizes several recent papers that have found specific functions for non-coding DNA, such as regulating gene expression, controlling development, and influencing epigenetic processes. He then reports on the latest new evidence: the function of short tandem repeats (STRs), previously considered “junk DNA.” Luskin also discusses the work of molecular biologist John Mattick, who has written recently about the shift in thinking about “junk DNA.” Luskin suggests a new way of looking at non-protein coding regions of DNA and concludes that, far from junk, these “highly compact information suites” are essential and serve a variety of important functions in the genome.


https://idthefuture.com/1885/
 

PlunkettsGhost

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2023
Messages
3,923
Reaction score
3,763
Junk DNA is just the latest iteration in a long line of failed/debunked 'vestigial' arguments, used to bolster the unfounded notion of evolutionary change.
 

PlunkettsGhost

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2023
Messages
3,923
Reaction score
3,763
I don't think that Liberalism is an attempt to continue Christianity without Christ at all.
Christianity is a communal affair that imposes group ethics, social standards of behavior and cultural norms. Totally antithetical to the Libertarian mindset.
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Imagine two individuals sharing 98% of their DNA sequences, yet exhibiting distinct personalities and preferences. This analogy aptly describes the puzzling differences between humans and chimpanzees, whose DNA sequence boasts a staggering 98.8% similarity. For decades scientists used comparative genomics to infer relationships.

This leads to some preposterous conclusions - we are 35% similar to a daffodil. Or humans are 94% similar to dogs. With the advent of epigenetics these studies are turning to comparative epigenetics.


 

Professor

Irrelevant
Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2023
Messages
3,123
Reaction score
2,305
Location
Another World
How does a vertical tree trunk manage to fossilize itself through multiple strata of rock, when the official narrative is that said strata take eons to be laid down on top of one another?

Is the official geologic timeline Bollox?

Oh that's an easy one. Just picture what you remember from watching earth quakes & landslides combined?

The earths shakes quakes and cracks open,Ok? then the landslide where the edge of a forest slides down into the deep dark coal seam - 100 million years after the coal had been forming . . . See?🧐
landslide_comparison_after_01-1024x683.jpg

 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Oh that's an easy one. Just picture what you remember from watching earth quakes & landslides combined?

The earths shakes quakes and cracks open,Ok? then the landslide where the edge of a forest slides down into the deep dark coal seam - 100 million years after the coal had been forming . . . See?🧐
View attachment 5022
The issue is that on many examples of polystrate tree fossils, there is no evidence of tectonic activity or a mudslide action in the strata surrounding the tree fossil.

There are examples which don’t make sense in the context of standard geological understanding.
 

Professor

Irrelevant
Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2023
Messages
3,123
Reaction score
2,305
Location
Another World
The issue is that on many examples of polystrate tree fossils, there is no evidence of tectonic activity or a mudslide action in the strata surrounding the tree fossil.

There are examples which don’t make sense in the context of standard geological understanding.
What could be the cause of such?
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Part 1 of destroying Neo Darwinism tonight is an interview with Astrophysicist Hugh Ross by Glenn Beck. A thoughtful Ross goes through his journey from Atheism to Theism through reason

 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Part 2 of destroying Neo Darwinism for the pseudo science that it is, comes from an interview with Dr. Romulo who attained a PHD in evolutionary biology from Yale and Oxford. Starting out as an atheist/materialist, he soon learned that neo Darwinian theory was horse-shit and unscientific and re-converted to Catholicism 5 years ago.

This is a long and thorough review, based fully from the view of science without needing to reference religion.

 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354
Scientists just discovered a new way cells control their genes — it's called 'backtracking' - Sahana Sitaraman


Scientists have discovered that, when a DNA-reading enzyme moves backwards along a gene, it may do so to help control when the gene is turned on.
 

Tiger

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2023
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
2,354

The Vacuous Rhetoric of Evolution

This is a quote from the 1966 Philadelphia symposium, but it is precisely the same sort of argument that any substantive critic of Neo-Darwinism keeps running into from the Neo-Darwinians:

Combinations of different genes occur such that every individual is a unique combination, and the selective assay of the value of each random mutation is performed simultaneously in this framework for thousands of mutations at a time. The acceptance of the neo-Darwinian concept of evolution appears to be eminently valid on this basis. However, a critical feature is the occurrence of mechanisms for genetic combination and recombination, and a major criticism of the neo-Darwinian concept which has been raised at this meeting is premised on the lack of such a mechanism in the initial steps of the evolution of a “sense” sequence of a polypeptide or polynucleotide from an initially “nonsense” sequence. It does not, however, seem an extreme extrapolation from the known facts of nucleic acid replication and transcription to envisage that combination and recombination are inherent features of polynucleotides, and the evolution of “sense” sequences then becomes a process of reasonable probability.
– Dr. Alex Fraser, Professor of Genetics, University of California Davis, California

Let’s break the argument down into its component parts:

1. There is no mechanism. This is readily admitted.

2. This lack of a mechanism renders the hypothesis impossible.

3. But it doesn’t strike the Neo-Darwinian true believer to be an extreme extrapolation to imagine what this nonexistent, never-observed mechanism could be if it existed, which it doesn’t.

4. And if we simply imagine that this nonexistent mechanism existed, then the proposed process that requires it in order to function becomes theoretically possible.

5. Therefore, the process works as imagined
 

Mad as Fish

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2023
Messages
4,110
Reaction score
5,628

The Vacuous Rhetoric of Evolution

This is a quote from the 1966 Philadelphia symposium, but it is precisely the same sort of argument that any substantive critic of Neo-Darwinism keeps running into from the Neo-Darwinians:

Combinations of different genes occur such that every individual is a unique combination, and the selective assay of the value of each random mutation is performed simultaneously in this framework for thousands of mutations at a time. The acceptance of the neo-Darwinian concept of evolution appears to be eminently valid on this basis. However, a critical feature is the occurrence of mechanisms for genetic combination and recombination, and a major criticism of the neo-Darwinian concept which has been raised at this meeting is premised on the lack of such a mechanism in the initial steps of the evolution of a “sense” sequence of a polypeptide or polynucleotide from an initially “nonsense” sequence. It does not, however, seem an extreme extrapolation from the known facts of nucleic acid replication and transcription to envisage that combination and recombination are inherent features of polynucleotides, and the evolution of “sense” sequences then becomes a process of reasonable probability.
– Dr. Alex Fraser, Professor of Genetics, University of California Davis, California

Let’s break the argument down into its component parts:

1. There is no mechanism. This is readily admitted.

2. This lack of a mechanism renders the hypothesis impossible.

3. But it doesn’t strike the Neo-Darwinian true believer to be an extreme extrapolation to imagine what this nonexistent, never-observed mechanism could be if it existed, which it doesn’t.

4. And if we simply imagine that this nonexistent mechanism existed, then the proposed process that requires it in order to function becomes theoretically possible.

5. Therefore, the process works as imagined
Which underlines how little we poor humans know about the working of nature, preferring to bundle all our ignorance up into one big ball and call it God.
 

PlunkettsGhost

Well-known member
Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2023
Messages
3,923
Reaction score
3,763
Which underlines how little we poor humans know about the working of nature, preferring to bundle all our ignorance up into one big ball and call it God.
Nice straw man you've constructed there.

There is no historical evidence that man believes in deities as some form of cope. It's almost like you've never read Augustine or Aquinas.

And the fact remains, there is no proven biological mechanism to support the theory of evolution. The real cope is out there, chiefly manifested by people who hang onto the doorframes of a failed worldview by claiming adaption is evolution . It isn't.
 

Latest Threads

Popular Threads

Top Bottom